Peter Lorimer tonight claimed Jonny Howson is happy with the financial side of his contract offer, but his decision whether to sign or not will be based on where Leeds United finish the 2011/12 season.

Fans at the Whitby Whites Leeds United On The Road event were voicing their frustrations at the lack of investment and failure to renew contracts when Jonny Howson’s current situation was raised.

Peter Lorimer responded to speculation that the club weren’t investing the necessary funds to secure Howson’s long term future by telling fans it had nothing to do with with the cash, and that Jonny’s hesitance is based solely on a desire to play Premier League football.

Also in attendance was Andy Lonergan who told fans he was hoping to be back for the Barnsley game on the 26th of November, but admitted it may be the game after.

Thanks to @Dr_LUFC for filling us in on the nights events. 

42 Responses

  1. Donny

    Thanks for for the heads up on Mr lorimers comments TSS…
    what an absolute cunt that man and my once hero has turned out to be , if the truth be told JH has got a very long way to go before he could even contemplate playing in the premier league and it’s quite unlikely to be the truth ,secondly old 70 MPH should start looking to score his beer tokens in a more honorable manner , being Bates ‘fan friendly’ mouthpiece fools no one and he should be thoroughly ashamed of himself…(but probably isn’t!)

  2. bitesyerlegs

    For the first time ever since 1964, I am really fed-up. We have no mid-field, therefore we are always chasing the ball. We need a ball-winner in mid-field (where is a “son of Batty”. Against Blackpool we sat back at 3 v 0 down and watched them – for goodness sake Leeds get stuck in, win the ball – you can’t do owt without it. As a consequence we are allways too deep, and then the O’Leary long ball comes into play. Come on Leeds, we are better than that OR ARE WE !

    • TSS

      Both central midfielders are capable of tackling. When we’re playing well, they dominate. The problems, as I see it, start when we decide to start a game with hoofballs and never look back. We have an extremely talented midfield we effectively bypass.

      The midfield is our sides biggest strength. We look useless when we decide to cut it out and try to play route one. When we get everyone into the game, keep the ball on the ground and pass it around we look 50x better than we have on other occasions.

    • Donny

      ‘Blinkered’ springs to mind…but then again we’re all entitled to our opinions i suppose…including you

    • TSS

      Wasn’t actually an opinion from “Me” though, can we try and keep things constructive please? Everyone supports the same team here and is frustrated for the same reason – ie. Bates is taking us nowhere in a hurry. Probably the same concerns JOnny has, rather understandably.

  3. Arthur Graham

    Like a growing number of fans it seems Howson hasnt got a lot of faith in leeds reaching the premiership anytime soon under Grayson and Bates. Hope Howson stays but cant blame him for wanting to move on. Just hope its to a team going somewhere and not wigan, wolves or some such other relegation fodder. Bates and Grayson out!!

  4. Donny

    Thats fine TSS …Howsen needs to concentrate more on his game though instead of standing back and admiring his one or two good passes… a bit of humility and hard work is called for , especially as captain…
    As far as lorimer goes , i will stand by my comments and i will leave it at that ,
    all the best chaps

    • TSS

      I know what you mean. I think he does put the graft in though, it’s just going unappreciated because he’s playing deeper than we’re used to. We know he can score goals and be a nuisance up front, and it’s frustrating us all (and him I suspect) that we’re not seeing that. MOT

      • Ron

        Well everyone is losing in this Howson saga it seems. His form is suffering as a result of negotiations and being played deeper, and therefore the team’s effectiveness suffers also. I am personally not surprised he wants to wait to see where we end up before he pens a new deal. No one doubts his love of the club, however, based on his unspectacular performances thus far, I can’t see a host of Premiership clubs queuing up for him just yet. That said, this forum was once a veritable shooting gallery for many a supporter who thought Bradley Johnson was shite. I daresay Norwich fans feel differently.

        Knuckle down Jonny and we all get what we want, provided Grayson grants him some freedom. The latter is difficult when you have the defensive frailties we have, and have had for a long time. Before I divulge and speak of Groundhog Day with regards to our back four, I shall end it there.

  5. Donny

    I appreciate what youre saying TSS , but as captain it’s his job to keep the shape of the team on the pitch and really if we’re playing a four man midfield he should ,in my opinion , should interact with Clayton more and decide who advances more and who goes deep and therefore keep the balance. I’m not a Howson hater as I think he could go on to be a very good player at the highest level,It’s just that I think he needs to continue working on his game and trying to improve.
    I don’t think were good enough to play 442 at this present time and losing Gradel has disrupted the balance of the team,in that we have not replaced him and it’s all about having options available . Although through injury we didnt see the best of him , i think Sanchez Watt would be the ideal replacement and potentially a better player for us than Max, as his all round understanding of the game seems to be a lot better. Although he has signed a new contract i think at the very least he would be available to us on loan .
    The problem with SG is that he seems to be more reactive instead of proactive . basically ,we have to be in the shit with a certain situation before he realises we have to do something about it and it’s just not good enough…

  6. Brolin's Love Child


    Peter Lorimer has done far more for Leeds than you ever will. The difference is he knows what is going on at Leeds, has a football brain and has proved himself as Leeds legend through and through for over 50 years..what have you done? To call him a c**t just shows what an arse you are! Have some respect!

  7. Donny

    Lorimer was a legend for us on the pitch and i was lucky enough to watch him in his prime, but what he has become is beyond belief . If people like yourself want to believe his nonsense then carry on.
    I havent played for Leeds ,but it doesnt really matter . i have put in more than a shift across the board over the years for leeds and as i said before ,everyone at our club is entitled to have their own opinionstart getting out more…i’m not getting drawn in to an argument with you fella but you should really get a life …start getting out more…
    TSS, thanks for you responses fella and i’ll leave it at that -)
    all the best

  8. AdsLUFC

    Completely agree with Donny fella. Lorimer a legend on the pitch no doubt, but now just another of Bates puppets towing the party line. Eddie Gray not farbehind either. They have both put their own interests before the club. The don and Billy must be turning in their graves. An utter disgrace.

    As for Howson I would not be overly concerned if he left and I knew we would replace him with quality. The problem is when he leaves we will be looking for a freebie or a loan

  9. paulc

    I have to say I do not believe one word Bates says anymore (through Lorimer).

    Howson can triple or quadruple any offer by Leeds by signing for any premiership club. Who would turn down that opportunity? More importantly though any player in the championship would be desperate to play in the premiership.

    I am sure that if the club looked like it would be anything other than a mid table championship outfit (but always hoping for play offs) Jonny Howson would have signed a new contract ages ago.

    The lad is obviously not willing to wait around maybe 5 years or more until the club can seriously start to challenge for promotion.

    Perhaps we fans need to realise the same, anybody watching Leeds United (even before the Blackpool game) must have seen how far away we are from seriously challenging for promotion and then being able to stay in the premiership…..miles and miles

    We should all wish Howson well , then Snodgrass..then Clayton…then Lees…as their ‘contract talks’ crop up , it will not change until we start to look a real prospect and the players believe it too.

  10. AdsLUFC

    The policy regarding contracts is despicable. Why was Howsons contract not negotiated when we got promoted? Why is Snoddys contract not being negotiated now? Same with Gradel.

    Why do we leave it until the last minute?

    The club has become a joke, a laughing stock.

    When Bates leaves all will fall into place

    • mattbb1

      you wont find many people willing to splash the cash at the moment, and thats working in bates’ favour.

      Banks by the way TSS will lend to build hotel and corporate facilites based on a 15 year lease – we have a longer lease than that on ER, so effectively Bates – CAN – borrow money as though he were the owner, so Bates isnt a snimpleton wasting money on his landlords property (and we all have our suspicions who that landlord is anyway)… “Morning Landlord Ken, how are you? Well I’m a handsome young bearded go getter today Tenant Ken.

  11. mattbb1

    when youre a club stuck in the doldrums of mid table championship, you lose your best players to bottom feeders in the PL. Just like a Barnsley, Ipswich, Sheffield United, oh i forgot they arent even in the championship.. anyhow. What can we expect? Howson will be gone at the end of the season. We have a strong midfield, and we need to use it, Clayton is pure class, varynen looks very capable, as does howson on his day, but he is more of a gerrard style attacking midfielder. Nunez, Snodgrass, Pugh, we should be pinging the ball around, but we dont do it often enough. ANd I’m also now getting fed up with lorimer towing the party line, its getting a little embarassing Peter, you know, deep down dont you, that this whole set up isnt right – dont you?..

  12. oldschoolbaby

    There is a lot of people who need to think bigger and learn something from this “debate”

    I`ve no idea of the truth of it but I`m prepared to give Messers Gray and Lorimer the benefit of the doubt.

    What is beyond dispute is that they both did o.k out of the game. If they were smart with their money they could be independent figures able to say, and do, what they like ( this may be the truth of it, they may genuinely support Bates ). Conversely, they may have been foolhardy leaving themselves skint and vulnerable to having to kiss Bates` arse to get by and pay the electric bill.

    Exactly the same with business. Ridsdale was foolish with money. He tossed the club into the shark tank and some people still can`t fathom why it was attacked by a passing shark.

    And yet we still have those, regardless of East Stand development, shouting For Leeds to splash the cash. Oblivious to potential consequences in the current economic climate

    Mr Howson deserves the benefit of the doubt `til he speaks publically. But it would hradly be surprising, in this world of mass delusion, if he was dreaming of the PL when, very obviously, his sole focus should be on proving, beyond reasonable doubt, that he`s good enough.

  13. number1inyorkshire

    if thats true then jonny howson will leave in January whats more he will know that then he can say i never wanted to leave ..

    he will know leeds can not allow him to leave for free so will sell him for dosh ..

    If he was a leeds fan /legend he could sign a deal with a get out clause if we do not go up so we get some dosh .

    or he can leave for free in June and get a massive signing fee .

    there are only a handful of teams he would get into and play regularly in prem and some of those are in danger of being relegated ,wolves ,Bolton ,Blackburn ,those in no danger he could get in are everton ,fulham maybe villa .
    He is not good enough for top 6 team ..

    i never thought he would sign so its no surprise !!

    i often wonder what lorimer gets out of his involvement at leeds ,he has been in or around for a while now he is in danger of losing his status at the moment he is still a legend

  14. Mark Billings

    I won’t pretend to know the ins and outs of contracts, whether they be football or otherwise, but the impression I get is that you can put pretty much anything in a contract.

    Therefore if, as Lorimer claims, Jonny is happy with the financial side of things, and his only ‘problem’ is what level we’ll be playing at next season surely a clause could be inserted saying ‘If Leeds United aren’t promoted, this contract is invalid’ or (and this one comes from Football Manager, I know it’s a game but I’m just using what I know) a minimum fee release clause of £0 to Premiership clubs. Either way he can sign the contract knowing that he is free to leave for Premiership football, in the second case, if he doesn’t get an offer, we get to keep him!

    Like I say, I know nothing about contracts, the second is based on FM, maybe someone much cleverer than me could say whether that is possible!

  15. AdsLUFC

    Oldschoolbaby, its people like you that allow Bates a free hand. Just because Gray and Lorimer were legends on the pitch does not mean they are untouchable off the pitch.

    The fact of the matter is that they clearly know that Bates is destroying our once prosperous club yet because they are receiving a nice pay packet they refuse to stand up and be counted for the benefit of the club. In fact they are making the problem worse.

    In respect of spending money, nobody is demanding a “splash of cash”. We clearly do not wanta return to thr ridsdale years. There is some middle ground. The club has made a fortune over the years from player sales and gate receipts. Our whols squad cost less than 1 million in transfer fees. We want the money that has been made at the club to be reinvested not placed into Bates back pocket or into a ground we dont (supposedly) own.

  16. Colin

    If Howson leaves next season and Leeds are in the Championship, it’s time to forget the PL any time soon.

    Paulc got it right, lose Howson, then get ready to lose Snodgrass, Clayton etc. when their contracts expire.

    The board run this club on a shoestring and we always fall into the trap of buy cheap, pay twice the price. Is Michael Brown meant to be a Johnson replacement? Is Danny Pugh ment to be a Gradel replacement? We’ve got clowns Paynter & Rachubka on contracts until Summer 2013, even though they’ll never play again for Leeds.

    We made one good signing this season – Lonergan. That’s it.

    There’s loads of holes in the structure at Leeds – is it the Board, is it Grayson? I’d say a mixture of both.

    As for Howson, well he’s just finally had enough. He’s seen who’s come in and he’s fed up with the lack of ambition and financial support from the club and he keeps seeing good players leave the club.

    Players who perform well are not rewarded with the new contracts that they deserve and shit players are brought in on higher wages than the players who are performing. Meanwhile because of the mistakes of others, Howson has to take the shit end of the stick and play out of position, every single game.

  17. oldschoolbaby

    Ads, I`m not sure what process of logic you used to conclude that I allow, or disallow for that matter, Bates from doing anything. As far as I can see he does as he pleases and rather enjoys a bit of confrontation along the way.

    For the record when Leeds were a public company I bought a not insignificant shareholding. Obviously I lost all my money – not sure where it went, on food for Ridsdale`s goldfish maybe. So I`ve done my bit to ensure the fans owned the club which would, hopefully, keep it out of the hands of the likes of Bates.

    As it is, and I still blame Ridsdale, Leeds is owned by Bates. Even at 80 he remains an enigma but I do know something about him. He`s from London and has no natural affinity for our club. I also know he`s had a string of business ventures through his life which he has looked to sell for a profit, Chelsea being one of them

    Obviously I`m not a postman in Monaco but I am taking the liberty of concluding an offer for Leeds from the Sultan of Brunei or Bill Gates has yet to land on his doormat

    Therein lying the major problem with the Bates Out campaign. You have nothing in the way of an alternative

    So while I wait for the new CEO of Apple to develop a sudden passion for Leeds United I try to focus on the Bates positives

    A scarily high number of football league clubs have debts they can`t service, Bates says Leeds don`t owe the banks anything. If that`s true, I, for one am grateful

    Virtually every football league chairman will tell you he can`t control his wage bill. They will also tell you a good number of their squades are arrogant, overpaid pieces of shit. Bates is making a stand. Fair play to him

    As for the arguments continually used against him I just can`t reconcile coffin dodging with asset stripping. I could be wrong but it doesn`t make sense to me

    Finally, when was the last time Leeds United were “prosperous” ?

  18. Henry Whyte

    It’s hard to blame Johnny. There is a bad atmosphere and feeling about and around the club at the moment. I have never been one to blame Bates up until this point but I can no longer defend his position. Let’s forget the argument that he taking the money and the lack of investment. I have no idea what really goes on there. He is an embarrassment to our club. He was hugely disrespectful to Bristol City. He has bad mouthed Schmichael, he disrespected Bradley Johnson. Despite what we think as fans, no chairman should be saying these things. Worse if all he is hugely disrespectful to the Leeds fans. The things he has written should have him banned from Elland Road. We are also the only club in the country that cannot listen to our team on local radio. It is time we did something. We need him out. I really don’t think he would sell to anyone. He likes the public position. He probably no longer cares about the money. We need organised and we need to be together. Not just a couple of hundred fans chanting abusive songs outside the ground. That loses respect from other fans with kids etc. I’m utterly fed up of it. Grayson and Bates out!!

  19. Matthew

    The only clubs who would be interested in him are ones that lose every other week, aka the bottom 6 premier league sides, and lets be honest if he went to anyone better he’d be on the bench most of the time.

    He has to make a choice, being the Captain of a huge football team(Well fanbase anyways and history) Leeds, or joining a club who will lose lose lose, like Kilkenny(Although he went to a Championship side)

    • Colin

      Completely wrong.

      Who’s the better player – Howson or Bradley Johnson? Last time I checked Johnson had scored 2 and got 2 assists and was at a team in the top half of the Premier League?

      I think there are plenty of top 10 PL teams willing to take Howson on. If he’s available in Summer, then he’ll be 24, in his prime, have experience of being the captain of one of the biggest clubs in England and he’s a gifted player.

      The bottom 6 in the PL will be at the back of the queue. He will be available for FREE. Therefore that’s ZERO risk. Worse case scenario, he’s shit (he’s won’t be) and then you sell him for £3-5m to one of the bottom 6.

      If you think Howson’s crap, then I hate to imagine what you think 2 goals and 2 assists Bradley Johnson is?

  20. Chareose

    Truth is we are going to lose 2-3 of our best players in the summer after failing to get promoted again.

    The key to the bates scenario unfortunately is to carry on voting with our feet and not going to games…….

    The decider will be next summer because if the fans dont get that feel good feeling back, few fans will invest in season tickets so we could be seeing 5k at elland road next season not 20

    At the very least Ken needs to spend some serious time sucking up to his customer base (the fans), he needs to prove to us he has the clubs best interests at heart but my gut feeling is its too late now. Unless he were to find a few million and we were suddenly able to pick up decent players next summer to replace the likes of howson, snodgrass and possibly clayton then the disenchantment of the fans will continue…. Carry on like this for a few more years and some of us will be suggesting we start a NEW football club like wimbledon.

  21. Chareose

    P.S be ready because the first trick Bates will pull will be a change of manager……… He will know deep down that Grayson has done a good job with limited resources but think about it….Bates needs to turn his income stream around and the longer this goes on the harder it will be.
    My bet is we will reach next summer and Bates will panic and look at what he can do to get the fans back to elland road. If as its likely he has limited funds at his disposal and players unwilling to join a club with a bad atmos then he will play the only trump card he has left – get a new manager in and hope it can pique the fans interest.

    Stupid really when with a bit of forsight Leeds could have been in the prem by now and Bates could be raking it in……………idiot

  22. AdsLUFC


    How do you know there is no alternative? Bates is completely immune to a tekover/investment. Any potential investors would never invest in the club while Bates is in charge (The council being one such organisation). Also how can you buy a club that is not for sale?

    There is a way to invest in the team without risking the financial stability of the club.

    So what do you say to the millions made in transfers in recent years that clearly has not been invested in the team?

    What do you say to the sale of our best players to be replaced by frees and loans?

    What do you say to spending 7 million on a stand that we dont even own, while the team rots?

    What do you say aboy the ridiculous ticket pricing policy which is pricing many fans out of ER (including young children)? We are paying premiership prices to watch frees and loans.

    What do you say about the alienation of the supporters clubs?

    I honestly cannot see what benefit Bates has brought to our club. People forget that this is our club not Bates and the sooner we rid ourselves of this scum the sooner we can move onwards and upwards.

  23. oldschoolbaby


    I know there is no one looking to buy the club as he / she / they would be bovine not to declare his hand. That would be the time for a Bates Out campaign. Bates` track record in buying and selling businesses has to indicate he would sell again

    You`re never satisfied but I`m not hugely discontented by our attacking and midfield options. Lonergan`s impressed me which, frankly, I wasn`t expecting. The defence, however, is entirely reliant for any type of functioning on two youngsters SG inherited. I blame him rather than Bates for the lack of defensive cohesion

    Exactly. Why would you spend £7,000,000 on a stand you don`t own ? Doesn`t he own it ? May that account for much of the income you talk of ? Which is why I have skipped points 2 and 3. BTW I am clearly on record as declaring the East Stand development senseless. I would like to see Bates fighting for a law change to allow for limited terracing making football affordable again

    So I am not happy about ticket pricing at all. As I`m determind to bring my son and nephew up as my father brought me up with a passion for Leeds United I know exactly how expensive it is. Businesses, though, tend to charge what they believe people are willing or able to pay. Market forces will prevail though

    He`s a grumpy old bastard why do we expect him to behave like anything other than a grumpy old bastard ?

    What benefit does he bring ? It`s called solvency, mate. My reading of the situation is that a significant majority of football league clubs have debts that are beyond their control. I strongly suspect there will be high profile casualties. Famous clubs will go to the wall. That fate once looked a realistic possibility for our club, and you`re right it is our club. Whether you like it or not. Whether you believe there was any morality in his abuse of the administration system. At least he`s navigated us a long way from the edge of the cliff

    And, to remind people again, at his age he isn`t a medium or long term problem

  24. AdsLUFC


    I respect your opinion as you do provide a balanced argument.

    However, I do not feel that a fear of the Ridsdale years is not an excuse to rely on frees and loans. We have made a fortune recently which has disappeared never to be seen again. The Gradel monies being the most recent point in case. Why couldnt the reported £3.5 million received from Gradel be reinvested in the team?

    On the East Stand point. The official line is that Bates does not own the stadium. In fact Bates claims he doesnt know who owns the stadium. Would you build an extension on a house you rented? The whole thing stinks. The lack of transparency is a disgrace.

    We complained about Leslie Silver but he was a saint compared to this crook

  25. oldschoolbaby


    I wish I`d come up with this theory myself but I read it in the paper. Some maths professor reckons that if you stick 150 sheets of graph paper together (15 x 10 )you are looking at 1,000,000 little squares. And that`s around the biggest number a human brain can properly comprehend. Beyond that it all gets a bit confusing.

    It`s the only rational explanation for the number of Chancellors, bankers and football club chairmen who have borrowed way more than they can realistically repay, causing the global mayhem which threatens us all

    Up to now those who have fucked up have been bailed out or skipped through the administration system. That`s not happening anymore. Lenders will demand their pound of flesh

    So, yes, Ridsdale like behaviour does terrify me. And, I`m afraid, I do believe that due to the £1,000,000 theory a lot of Leeds fans still don`t grasp what a cunt he was and how close he came to destroying our club.

    Bates, although he`s a miserable, disrespectful old bastard, does seem to understand the value of money and the danger of debt

    It is inconceivable that he doesn`t know who owns E.R. Equally that the tightwad would put an extension on someone elses house. You have to suspect he owns E.R and T.A so you could argue the family silver is back in the same basket

    I suppose that you deserve every, wild or not, accusation you face if you hide your finances in a sleepy Caribbean hollow. Equally, I suppose, there`s little point flashing the £17,000,000 he made out of Chelsea as he`d never receive a sensible quote for a player again

  26. Paul John Smith

    Sign up for your home town club as Captain or off fuck off some fcuking loyalty boy!

  27. Roger Nicholson

    If he isn’t good enough to play at Leeds (because let’s be serious, the problem at Leeds is the lack of a midfield general) how the hell could he expect to play in the PL? I always look back at the last triumphant 2nd div campaign and think Strachan , Jones, Davidson, Batty and so on (Speed anyone?) and then think come on Johnny get stuck in!

  28. Jerry Smith

    Shouldnt be captain I agree with roger had a poor central midfield last 2 years aswell never kill teams off

  29. Marc Dodsworth

    Stop playing like a cunt and we could get there, you’ve been shit all season howson


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